Hi all, in the UK we’ve got some services where as a customer you give the company a wad of cash, and they invest it and manage it for you. Similar to an ETF but not exactly. It is closer to a pensions provider. The pricing data isn’t public and there’s no specific quantifiable share or whatever. In my case this is nutmeg, though there are others such as Hargreaves Lansdown and some others. Is there an easy way to track this in Portfolio Performance? I’m happy to update the pricing manually but I’m not quite sure how the tracking would happen. Thanks!
Hey potatomashing,
you can “invent” a name for a security for that investment as it basically is a fund, as you stated. You do not use autmatic historical data. You can manually provide pricings. Everything else is the same as for other shares or funds, except that you most probably will not have so many historical quotes.
Maybe I did not get your question correctly.
Cheers for the response.
Yeah I imagined that’s what I have to do, however, I want to track the profits with it as well. This is what I’m struggling with. I’m not sure what the price I’d provide would be.
As an example, I have a nutmeg account where I top up £100 a month. There is no “buy in” per se. Over the next 30 days my pot is worth £102. I topup another £100, so now it’s worth £202. Then next month £2 up + £100 = £304 pot value. How would I track the current value of the pot and the actual deposits so that for example in the charts it correctly shows the percentage this specific “fund” is up or down.
In regards to the accuracy of the quotes, that’s totally fine since it’s unavoidable. I suppose it will be as accurate as my effort in keeping it up to date.
Hey potatomashing,
that sounds easy. In PP you can establish a savings plan, e.g. 100 GBP per month. PP creates that for you automatically and informs you that it did. You then can edit that booking were you enter the new “per share” price, e. g. for the second month 102 GBP, 104 GBP for the third in your example.
Since you do not have offical shares you have to invent a nominal value initially. This could be one per GBP, i. e. For the first month you purchase 100 shares for 1 GBP per share, for the second month you purchase 98.03922 shares for 1.02 GBP per share, for the third month 96.15385 shares for 1.04 GBP per share (With numbers of shares times price per share equals your saving rate).
Does this makes sense?
Edit: After re-reading your post a small correction. Since you mentioned “my pot is worth” it means you have to calculate the actual share price by “value of pot” devided by amount of shares in. In your example
First month
- pot worth 0 GBP
- shares in pot 0 pc
- price per share 1 GBP/pc
- new shares 100 GBP / 1 GBP/pc = 100 pc
Second month
- pot worth 102 GBP
- shares in pot 0 pc + 100 pc = 100 pc
- price per share 102 GBP / 100 pc = 1.02 GBP/pc
- new shares 100 GBP / 1.02 GBP/pc = 98.03922 pc
Third month
- poth worth 204 GBP
- shares in pot 100 pc + 98.03922 pc = 198.03922 pc
- price per share 204 GBP / 198.03922 pc = 1.03009 GBP/pc
- new shares 100 GBP / 1.03009 GBP/pc = 97.0780 pc
Hard to follow I know, but really straight forward once practised. Maybe a small spreadsheet does help here.
alternatively you can “black box” it as an account, not a security. Your payments to this account are transfers and at the end of each month (or quarter, or week, etc.) you compare the balance in PP with your nutmeg account and book the difference as interest.
I quite like @Harry_Hirsch idea though it seems really fiddly. I tried doing a few weeks deposits worth of it but it took way too long.
Using interest as the difference as @SgtWinter suggested worked.
For anyone else stumbling upon this in the future and would like to import the initial data from nutmeg you can go into your nutmeg pot details while you have your browser console open. Under the network tab you will find a request along the lines of:
GET history?period=ALL
Click on it, then click response, then raw if that’s an option, and copy the whole JSON into a file. You can then use the following jq filter to generate an importable CSV.
jq '[foreach .points[] as {$date, $returnValue} ( {}; {prev: .curr, curr: $returnValue}; { $date, returnValue: (if .prev != null then .curr - .prev else .curr end) } )] | map({date, returnValue, type: (if (.returnValue < 0) then "Interest Charge" else "Interest" end)}) | (.[0] | to_entries | map(.key)), (.[]|to_entries |map(.value)) | @csv' -r $FILE_NAME > $IMPORTABLE_FILE
Just make sure you replace $FILE_NAME and $IMPORTABLE_FILE. Then import the file at $IMPORTABLE_FILE as a CSV, map the columns and then, once the import is done, it should match your nutmeg pot. Don’t forget to import the deposits first!
Thanks both for your help!
ok, I thought you do that once per month. In case you have historical data you can import those via csv import and only edit your monthly savings the way i suggested.
I am glad you found a solution
Have fun